i agree on this. how much money was wasted just to show we can build a car. real stupidity, and blame Dr. M, ariya's hero. off topic a while, do u know that 1 billion ringgit malaysia was exchanged for 1 malaysian astronaut to go on space with russia space programme? if that 1 billion ringgit malaysia is divided among 20 million ppl here, everyone here get some 50 ringgit. not much but don't u think it's a waste to spend on one man? and on ego to say we went to space, without gaining anything????and of course without gaining the r&d and technologies too.........sigh
LOL! They want to put it into the Malaysian Book of Records I think. Real stupid. I just saw on newspaper it's selling for something like RM88 or RM188.
Well, I don't think I can fault the Malaysia Boleh! (Malaysia Can!) spirit. A national car project like Proton is a great way to boost our country's manufacturing capabilities as well as reduce our dependence on foreign cars. However, somewhere down the line, the people at Proton forgot that they were the pride of the nation. Instead of working to make us proud by producing quality cars that EVERYONE can be proud to be seen in, Proton has fallen so low as to manipulate the patriotism of every Malaysian who buys Proton cars. It is a known fact that Proton practices double standards. Cars marked for export are of comparatively superb quality and built while cars marked for local consumption are little more than deathtraps. Poorly built with very poor quality control. And believe it or not, we are paying more for our Milo tin-edition Proton cars than what other people are paying for the export-grade Proton cars overseas. Regarding the latest pride of the nation - Gen 2, I must say I was VERY disappointed when Proton actually COPIED the cabin design from Lotus wholesale. Of course, the Gen 2 had the metal parts substituted for cheap plastic parts. For all of Proton's investment in R&D and Lotus, all they can do is copy??? And badly at that too? Sorry, but I think I have just about had it with Proton. If there's a no confidence vote on Proton, you can count me in!
Aren't you a little bit harsh by saying that the CAMPRO is only as powerful as a decade old 1.8L engine? You can't compare your Nissan's engine with the CAMPRO since your Nissan's engine has gone through many evolutions to achieve such performance where as the CAMPRO is just at the beginning of the stage. Also, don't forget that the CAMPRO was built with cam-phasing technology in mind and it could still be possible for it to whoop a 1.8L Waja.
Me being harsh? It's more like Proton trying to bullshit us saying it's more powerful than a 1.8l engine. Did you hear the advertisement on radio??? And why are they releasing a 'Campro-less' Campro engine? More hypes, hypes, hypes... At first I was rather impressed by the Campro engine, but it's all the hypes, QC which let me down. Don't forget, Campro is also an unproven engine! No one in the public has actually tested the car. But they actually claimed that it's twice more reliable than traditional engine. If that's not bullshit, I don't know what is. Yes, all the statements above are heard from radio ads.
malaysia advertisement all cheat ppl the most funny "fact" is that there is 1 brand of paddy doesn't have carbohidrate
Let me put it this way, assume that Proton's lawyers files a defamation lawsuit against you because you were telling everyone that their ads were utter bullshit but where are your sources? You buried yourself by stating; "Campro is also an unproven engine" and since it's unproven, how would you know it doesn't live up to expectations? Also, if you cared to follow up on the development of the SENG engine, you'd also know that the engine was developed to incorporate cam-phasing technology in mind and that doesn't mean every model you buy will get you the cam-phasing technology and it's called CAMPRO partly because it's capable of having the cam-phasing engine installed. It's like telling everyone you have a automatic option but it will only be available later and same goes for the cam-phasing. This is what you call marketing and they're bound to stretch the truth to gain some extra dough.
harrrrr.....??????..........not all campro engine will have dat cam phasing tech???? ..........then why call it campro?????? like dat should call the engine...........malaygine with or w/o campro tech.......... OT.....sleepy/avenger.......wat no carbohidrate rice is dat??????
Proton! Oh! Proton! I think I've discussed this issue several times with friends as well as other online forums. Firstly when Proton was planned at the first place, there were lots of criticism about the project as it is not a feasible project. The automobile industry is already tight and our population is too small for such a mega project. Of course the PM then was confident and went on with it. For me, I do think that Proton does have a chance to fight with other giants but they should realise that they are in a very very TOUGH STRUGGLE with other international players. Malaysia Boleh! But make sure Proton proves that they are working their ass 24/7 to prove that! Instead of struggling to compete, they were too relax. In their own mentality, hm... since our competitions are having a tax on their price tag, Malaysians will obviously have no choice to buy except for Proton unless they are willing to fork out more cash in order to get a non-proton car. So with this mentality, what for they need to come out with new innovation and models. Look at the Saga/Iswara model, a nearly 20 year old car still selling in the showroom. This is damn low for any car manufacturer. To them, why spend millions if not billions into new vehicle R&D if Malaysians are still happy (indicated by number of sales) with the old one? Here are several points that can be added into their new Proton power ranger/thunder cats advertisement: Which company dares to use the same model for more than 10 years... Which company dares to say that Malaysians don't need Air Bags... Which company dares to seek protection all the time.... Proton.... we dare to change the meaning of car production. When AFTA draws near and international players having aggressive price cut (without compromising quality), Proton starts to sweat and were forced to develop newer cars like WAJA and GEN2. Obviously this was a rush job and you could see it with their rough worksmanship and quality. I would darely say that their older "MITSUBISHI CLONES" are much better than the newer WAJA and GEN2 in terms of quality. Of all the horror stories that I've heard about the newer cars like Iswara, surprisingly my home town car a 1991 Saga 1.5I is still rock solid (Even my power window never failed despite being used for long and rough Sarawak trunk road driving). That car has more mitsubishi parts than Proton as there are lots of parts marked with MMC on them. My point is that Proton's quality has degraded with time even when they were manufacturing clones of other proven cars. If copy can't be done right, what more if they stand on their own. Quality is dropping, no doubt and Malaysians are become the sore losers. Can someone dare to tell me that Proton has QUALITY? Now I think that the LULUS sticker on every Proton car is being stucked there by some low level worker in the factory line. Quality Control department must have been closed down long time ago or they are simply sleeping. On GEN2, only one word to describe it. DISAPPOINTING. No Airbags included and yet a heavy price tag. I can personally conclude that Proton is a failed automobile industry. Not saying that Proton is doomed from the start, as I believed that Proton can survive and be the best if it is managed properly. With a leg shaking management, Proton is a heavy price to bear for all Malaysians. Proton doesn't deserve our respect, they should earn it by proving that they do well in development and quality control. To those who are ultra patriotic, I salute to you!! Go ahead and buy a Proton and forgive every single defect you may encounter. Malaysia Boleh is really a good way to motivate Malaysians. But I'm not a blind patriot. We can boleh in so many fields but doing something for the sake of glamore (Proton, Space Project, etc. etc.) is a waste of money. *Instead of using that money for space, how about Building something useful or use that to pay off tolls for our major highways. I think drivers will be more happy for toll-less highway than to see a Malaysian in Space.
What do you mean where are my sources? That's exactly what they say on the radio. Just asked anyone who listens to radio. I'm not bullshitting about my facts either. About the reliability, they say it will last 10 years before major overhaul (yup, it's from the advertisement too). So did my older N13 Sentra. 12 years without any overhaul. So there goes their claim. If they say their Campro engine is more powerful than a 1.8L engine, assuming their spec is even correct to begin with, 110bhp/140Nm, I'm pretty sure there are many 1.8L engine on the road which is more powerful than their Campro. Even my more than 10 year old engine has 110/125. Seriously, I didn't complain much about Campro, since it's still unproven, both reliability and performance, and didn't dare to compare much, until I heard that statement "It's more powerful than some 1.8L cars". Yeah, nothing wrong with that statement. It's more powerful than old some 1.8L engine. Period. I'm assuming that you know that very well too. What sources do I need. I'm pretty sure you can give more knowledgable facts than I do. Yes, I don't follow their developement. Because I will only see it "when it's done". Just like any computer parts. The marketing seems to overhype their product even before launching. Only stupid consumers will fall for their trap. No offense to anyone here, especially if you are just ordered your Gen-2. I'm just expressing my opinion.
If you care going through my post again, I'm afraid you missed my point. Based on the advertisements, you're disputing the fact that they're capable of producing such performance figures but do you have a valid source such as a documented test that tells a different story? Even their specs might not be correct to begin with, but has it occured to you as well that your car might not even provide the performance figures based on the available specifications? Did you even know that the quoted BHP are all from the flywheel and not the wheels? It seems that you have alot of doubts on the capabilities of the CAMPRO engine but do you think the government would spent RM400M++ on the development of anngine with mere performance figures or reliability? What's wrong with having to overhaul an engine after 10 years of use? You don't need to overhaul your engine because the wear and tear is still minimal and it depends on how an individual treat his/her car. Even if you think your car needs not to be overhauled after 12 years just because it is working, do you know you might have lost compression which results in a higher petrol consumption. The figures are there to provide you a general view of the cars performance and shell life and by no indiation that it will collapse after 10 years old or the engine will be stuck at 110BHP after multiple dyno runs? Again you said you dare not compare much but still you debating the capabilities of the CAMPRO to a 1.8L engine but yet you have not seen the actual performance of the engine yet. Also, there is always a fineprint that you should read as they conduct the test in different conditions which might yield the same performance result of a 1.8L engine in terms of mileage, power loss through drivetrain and so on. Note: If you have doubts over the credibility of a particular organization products, always take their advertisements or claims with a pinch or salt or perhaps a truck load instead.
Yeah, I do know that fact. But why make claims that seemed normal, by exaggerating them? Sorry. I judged a company up to 90% by its marketing. You may not agree with how I see things. But this is how I judge. This is another reason why I hate nvidia so much. Yup, because of marketing as well. Well, but since you look at the engine developement so much, but what about the rest of the car?? I knew you will keep stressing on the engine capabilities even before I posted my earlier message. A car is not complete with just a good engine. Just to let you know that I don't doubt the Campro engine because you seemed to be misled by what I said. As I've mentioned earlier, I judge a company by their marketing. I was rather pissed by the advertisement. Didn't I told you I was pretty impressed by the engine specification the last time we met? Well, if you trying to argue that Campro's spec is not accurate, what about the other 1.8L engine? It could be inaccurate as well. I hope you understand why I posted all these. Yup, overhyped marketing advertisements. I HATE THEM! It just shows how unconfident they are with their product. So are you saying they should send so much on developing the engine and neglect the rest of the car? This is perfectly unacceptable. A good car needs a complete package.
i must say ... yes ./. the engine can be more powerful .. but that means it might use up more fuel than a standard car.. why the hell do you think honda has 2.0L engine which produce about 150hp while another 2.0L @ about 250hp?.. obviously one is tuned for fuel efficientcy while the other is tuned for performance! guess what ? .. my CRV has better fuel comsumption than the WAJA .. though 2.0L vs. 1.6L is unfair.. but a CRV 2.0L seems to save much more fuel than the stupid WAJA.. yet .. its more powerful .. i can feel its power when you slam the gas pedal!.. WAJA .. uwek .. guess what .. wanna know how poor WAJA QC is ?.. i just had a mojor overhaul recently.. & now my engine is beginning to stall ... its an automatic .. yet it stalled !!! Fck proton for their QC! that the most dissapoint fact bout proton !.. what the hell are they doin in R&D? like adrian said .. copy lotus .. wtf ? can you just make something better than facelifting old models ??? can you create something better???? i proudly say .. PROTON SAGA is the best car compared to all other protons!
agree with chai dat a car is more than engine.........also dunno dis campro good or not............but they say it realli save petrol........ ..........dunno realli true or not..............but look at dat car........gen 2 realli look like plastic toy.........
BTW, have anyone of you heard the Proton radio advertisement for the Gen 2? They are claiming that the Campro is a Lotus-designed engine.. Heh... I always thought they said that the Campro was a locally designed and built engine. Now they say it was designed by Lotus.
Plotong make a BIG mistake...in their Gen2 catalouge, they written the bore and stroke for Gen2 1.6 as 7.6cm and 7.8cm. use (7.6/2)^2 x pi x 7.8(stroke) = 1415.945cc hahahahahah!!! idiot people do idiot thing...even engine's specs also can write wrong plotong...
