New tyres front or rear?

Discussion in 'Lounge' started by Dashken, Jan 22, 2015.

  1. jamotto

    jamotto Newbie

    So what about those of us who have RWD cars.

    Front to maintain steering?
  2. Adrian Wong

    Adrian Wong Da Boss Staff Member

    I think it's still better to put the new tyres at the back, even for RWD vehicles.

    After all, the main concern isn't which wheels are being powered but the fact that we can control the front wheels, but not the rear wheels.
  3. jamotto

    jamotto Newbie

    If the front tires hydroplane then your going to spin left or right depending on which direction the drive shaft turns due to Torque steering, but I could be crazy :nuts:
  4. zy

    zy Staff Member

    That all depends if you are changing speed or maintaining speed.
    As long as you maintain the speed, torque steer will be reduced.
  5. Chai

    Chai Administrator Staff Member

    This is very untrue. What is the point of having all the grip behind when your front tyres (steering) loses control, means you have no control over the steering (understeer)?

    This is why manufacturers recommend swapping the tyres regularly to even the wear, which allows all 4 tyres to have even grip levels.

    Many cars are aligned/designed to understeer, which means when you pushed to the limit, your front loses control, but it is much easier to regain control by slowing down. However, when going downhill, you can't just regain control by releasing throttle. Braking may make situation worse as most cars have stronger brakes in front, even with ABS and EBD. You might just end up in a tree like the video below.

    This Top Gear video explained this in a humorous :haha: but accurate way of the difference between understeer and oversteer. Both can be equally dangerous when grip level is low.

    Last edited: Feb 3, 2015
  6. Adrian Wong

    Adrian Wong Da Boss Staff Member

    Wait.. are you saying that for FWD vehicles, it makes sense to put newer tyres in the back, but it's the reverse for RWD vehicles?

    Wouldn't it be the same whether it is FWD or RWD, since the front tyres are still the ones being controlled?
  7. zy

    zy Staff Member

    Lol, its very subjective matter, in the end it really depends on the driver's skill and the tires being used.

    Well, what defines better/newer? different model of tires? or same tires with deeper threads?

    As previously posted, on dry weather, it doesn't matter, in fact bald tires might be better for braking in dry weather.

    Wet weather, that's where it makes some difference. However, if you drive like an idiot, no tires can save you.
  8. jamotto

    jamotto Newbie

    Well thankfully my skill is unmatched...up to about the time I go careening off the roadway. Yep, anytime before then I am the best. I did learn though over-steer is best, I don't want to see that tree.
  9. Chai

    Chai Administrator Staff Member

    No, all tyres need to be in control at all times. It doesn't matter whether it is FWD or RWD, any single tyre losing control is dangerous, unless you are a racing driver with excellent reflexes.

    It is only about minimizing the tyre loosing grip. FWD tends to understeer, and RWD tends to oversteer if you don't know how to control your throttle. If you are a racing driver, you want to put the best and biggest tyre at the front, while RWD on the back for maximum traction while accelerating.

    For us normal peasants, all tyres should have similar grip level, unless your car has terrible understeer from factory which many manufacturers think that's safer for you, because slowing down is the usual method of stopping understeer. :nuts: But I don't think that's true in all situation and I like my car to be equally balanced.
  10. Lacus

    Lacus Newbie

    On a side note, advisable to have 2 diff set of tyres installed? My front and back tyres are from 2 different manufacturer
  11. Adrian Wong

    Adrian Wong Da Boss Staff Member

    You couldn't find the same set of tyres?

    Good point though - what if you have two different sets of tyres?
  12. Chai

    Chai Administrator Staff Member

    This is pretty much similar to having new and old sets of tyres on both axles. It is fine for most people, but not recommended by my standards, because the different set of tyres may have significantly different performance characteristics from your existing ones. Then again, most people won't even notice it since they never exceed beyond the limits of their tyres.

    I always prefer having similar sets of tyre performance on all 4 wheels for predictable handling.
  13. atwl77

    atwl77 Just Started

    Hmm anyone here using nitrogen in their tyres?

    Yesterday when I took my car to my regular mechanic for checkup and servicing, he bought a brand new nitrogen pump thingy and recommended I fill my tyres with nitrogen. Ok sure, no probs, seems worth it.

    Later I check the Internet there's a lot of pro nitrogen and anti nitrogen debates, lol... :haha: :nuts:
  14. Adrian Wong

    Adrian Wong Da Boss Staff Member

    From what I understand, the main difference is the lack of moisture, not the lower weight of the nitrogen. In any case, in day-to-day use situation, there's apparently no difference in performance. After all, regular air is already 78% nitrogen! :D
  15. atwl77

    atwl77 Just Started

    Most of the arguments I read come down to, if you maintain your tyres properly there should be no difference between regular air and N2.

    That means it should still be beneficial to lazy guys like me :haha: :haha: :haha:
  16. Adrian Wong

    Adrian Wong Da Boss Staff Member

    Well, it looks like nitrogen leaks out a little less than oxygen, due to its larger molecular size, but since regular air is only 21% oxygen, the difference in deflation time is probably imperceptible... unless they actually drain out the air in the tyre and filled it with pure nitrogen.

    If they didn't drain the air out of the tyre and just pumped in nitrogen, there probably wouldn't be much of a difference.

    Even if they pumped out half of the air and refilled the remainder with pure nitrogen, the final composition would be 88-89% nitrogen and 11-12% oxygen... a difference of just 9-10%...
  17. belikethat

    belikethat Just Started

    ditto that
  18. zy

    zy Staff Member

    Especially for me who drives in snow. That's a big no no when mixing tires.
  19. atwl77

    atwl77 Just Started

    The nitrogen pump thingy has a complete drain and refill function.
  20. jamotto

    jamotto Newbie

    Normal air generally leaks about 1 PSI per month from a tire, while Nitrogen leaks about 0.33 PSI per month to me that is insignificant.

    Most of the tire stations that use Nitrogen use multiple cycles of purge/fill to bring the purity of Nitrogen to 93% to 95% because any less than that doesn't really offer any advantages over regular air.

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