i been looking forward to work in proton after i finish my study in Australia. is that a good idea to work in our lovely proton company? I heard that they are making a very good QC car recently, just wonder if they need new engineer or not. guess what, i am mechanical engineer from MOnash University, Clayton, Australia. hope what i learn is good enough, and later can design new car that is better than all of the previous. I read that people state proton is a piece of crap, but dont you ever think that all others car company start with crap car too? KIA, from Korea, what is the based project? They are building military truck over long ages, and Malaysia government bought the truck for military purppose. fairly good one. But how is the on road car? isnt that crap? Ferrari, they are no making any money from their car. trust it, coz the amount they sold is very little, compare to other car manufacturer, such as Ford. how they make money? from the heavy mechinary, such as shipping yard heavy loader. Merc, they build ship engine, not only car engine. and merc engine isnt that good like you think of, they are damn hot, and often need modify before put into malaysia. Fiat, hope that someone know it, this company build car, and one of the car which used as rally race is very good. but for other car, all crap. guess what, this company make engine for F4, and F14, or F16, forget, but those jet engine. Rocroy(those expensive car), they also make engine for Boeing aeroplane. but guess what, they steal infomation from other air plane company. name, forget, but what i know is, their air plane engine crap. often have problem. Honda, yeah their engine is good. Proton need stronger Quality control, and the most important thing is, which no one know, proton need more engineer. copy thing is the way to survive(Japan did), but, when you copy it, learn from it and upgrade it(Japan did again). people argue that proton crap, i suggest that you change what you are doing now, get into university, study engineering, go to work in good companay for years, then turn back here, and work for proton R&D department. make them growth. they need us, young and brilliant engineer. not that old idiot. they really need more engineer than all those commerce people. commerce people only know how to make something that is impossible to possible via loud sound, and picture. but, engineer cant make it becoz the tech we have is so little. Spend money to buy Lotus is to learn from them, not to copy. okie, that is it, i am going to study hard in my engineering, and then serve there, see another 10 years later, if proton cant beat Japan car, you come and make them close forever
Well since some day you will be making cars,,,, I have one request. Please make one that will not rust out in less than 20 years. And I will be first in line to buy. Trinity BTW, WELCOME TO ARP!
then from now, you better try to pump more money in proton. they need them, partly make them rich, partly make them do more work. they need better management. let see if they work or not. and there is posibility a new car company run in the future, call Neutron. but still, you should be proud that Proton able to copy and paste, although cant paste well, they still able to do it. if throw it to you, you wont make it. i will be proud to serve there. btw, i wont think of making a car to last for 20 years, and dont be fool. if you want malaysia have strong car manufacturer, first, try to make the steel fabrication plant work well, make good steel, then engineer baru can make good car. we bought steel from others, we bought plastic from others, we bought engine for others, what you can expect those R&D doing. they just porpose buyt his buy that, plug in, then a car coming out
Hello Francis, It's not so much that Proton comes out with crap cars. It's their attitude that pisses people off. Quality control is not a problem actually. Look at their "export-grade" cars and look at those meant for "local consumption". It's very evident that Proton and any other car company in the world can maintain any level of quality control they want... IF they want to. That's the real question. Does Proton want to maintain good quality control? IMHO, not at all. As far as Proton is concerned, good quality cars must be reserved for export markets because they have to meet stringent quality levels. But what do they do with cars that don't make the grade? Well, that's what loyal Malaysians are for, aren't they? If you compare a export-grade car and a car meant for local consumption, you will notice the disparity in quality, features and build. It's evident that Proton has deliberately made cars that are very much poorer in quality and features for local consumption. This is not the only double standard practiced by our "national" car company. Not only do they sell us lousier cars, they also charge us MORE for that dubious privilege. For the money we pay, we should be getting export-grade cars, not the junk Proton is selling us. If we believe Proton when they say that it's expensive to make junk cars like that, one wonders how they can sell export-grade cars with have better build, quality and features for less. In other words, are we subsidizing Proton's penetration of foreign markets? You said that we should be proud that Proton can copy and paste. You said that if we tried to do it ourselves, we wouldn't be able to. IMHO, I seriously doubt it can be any worse. Our government and people have subsidized Proton's growth over the years. But what do we have in the end? A car company that still does nothing but copy and paste. In short, Proton was a failure from the start. Why? Because although it was created as a national car project, the people who created it never truly believed in it. The government used it as a way to wantonly create jobs, even for the unqualified. And Proton's management just saw their position as a way to make money by abusing a naive people's trust and loyalty. Pump more money into Proton? Might as well throw it down the drain. What Proton needs is NOT more money. What Proton needs is pride in their work and some common sense. Thank God for AFTA. Maybe some competition will force Proton to turn themselves into something other than a leech. And yes, Francis, I am a LOYAL Malaysian and I drive a Proton. I'm just not a blind one.
francis.. how many years have proton been surviving.. how much improvements have they made? negative!! do you know that the QC of their first proton sagas are far way better that those current ones sold to us ?... wanna compare ? .. proton wira / iswara always have rust spots .. leaks.. etc etc.. did you know that a waja i had at home was sent to major overhaul when its just less tahn 2 years old ??? did you know that my dad got really pissed of with proton he ended up buying a honda ???? did you know that my waja was the worse car we ever had??? the main problem is the attitude problem .. the "apa pun boleh" attitude.. Malaysia Boleh ! boleh apa ? .. boleh buat apa apa saja ! .. yeah .. thats true.. do anything you like. . sell protons cars at high price.. they have been spoonfed .. look at the cars,... all AHBENG-ish .... i'm darn sick of their cars ... COME UP WITH SOMETHING ORIGINAL MAN! buch of copycats
no matter how good u immortalize proton car, or how good your brains is in management or strategy to develope proton, the point is they don't need you( they'd prefer some bins or bintis). and they will never change. till one day, when big trouble comes.
Once I complete my studies, I (seriously) is thinking of applying as a Automotive Designer at either Toyota, Ford Australia or Holden
The thing with Proton is it is a political company. Perodua is too, but the thing with Perodua is, Daihatsu has a major stake, and they have a word to say in a lot of things. Proton? Good cars? Do you mean the Juara? Arena? Oh please. Quality? The waja is Crap! My friend drives one. Its a shitbox! Another things is Power windows. How many of you Proton owners have problems with your power windows? 2 Windows in my friends waja is Kaput. Did you know the first 20,000 units of Waja were recalled? Go and work somewhere else. I bet the big fish will be interested in you. At least, you'll get paid better....
Yeah, Proton is a political company. If it's a real business with no support from the government, it would have folded a long time ago. NO real businessman will run Proton the way they have been running it for so long. If you want to see a model of incompetence and gross mismanagement, Proton is the IDEAL model. Honestly, Proton can be something. But the people controlling Proton are just interested in making a quick buck or to further some political agenda. So, right now, it's a pride project that's leeching away our tax money, as well as the money of hardworking Malaysians who are forced to buy Proton cars. Maybe things will change. Well, at least I hope things will change at Proton. Maybe you will do some good in Proton. Maybe you will just come out of Proton disillusioned, like the rest of us. I don't know. But it's certainly good to dream.
well, i am actually not loyal with proton. but, the more i stay in Australia, the more feeling that i want to go back to M'sia. i don tknow h ow you guys think. coz, i believe it is all negative thing. I am proud to be as a M'sian, why? we learn how to cope with all other races, not just say I am the best. I am chinese, but i know that, if a chinese dont work with malay, then it will end up like what u saw last time, Indonesia, Jarkata case. you should be proud that this not happen in malaysia. even US, yeah, they are so good. but, do you know that racism happen there? Australia also like that. they say whatever thing they did is the best around the world. As a Malaysian, i somehow feel bad that everything we try to do, we say Malaysia boleh, and end up we cant. Business, yeah it sound good, isnt it? then, see, what business we are making? Sorros that bustard and fuxk up our economy in one day. you are joking that m'sia is good in business. manufacturer production company, which one is contorl by ourself that can run throughout the world? almost none. Kuching here, we have many chip manufacturer factury,and the only chip that meet the world level is US company. Why we cant beat them? Technology level low? yes, it is in fact. if all malaysian behave like that, then how much you think business can run here? Proton is bad, they make 2 grade of cars, one for export(pratically good), one for local. See what spec waja is. 1.6L with 60KW, 1.8L with 73KW. any other compnay make such a 'good' engine? 15years before, they are. we are using human power to assembly all the parts together, leakage always happen, as we DONT HAVE QUALIFY ENGINEER for the department. Welding on the engine intercooler, radiator need very high skill in process. you think learn it through TV, or through someone can be a successful welder? Welding QC Engineer is very important, and how many we have through out m'sia that is qualify? those good welder in US to make money. I myself, why i so deseprate to serve in Proton, coz i wish to see that M'sia one day can beat the other country, tell them that a country with mix population doesnt mean we are a plate of sand that never bind up, and work together. Proton is political company, to beat the political problem, that is more good qualify engineer to work there. Without those good people, no matter how good the business we malaysia have, they will be all like bubble, can collapes easily. See Hong Kong, if china government dont support them, you think HK still can be so rich? they afraid of economy crisis. any little change, their ecnomy will down into drain. without production, no country can actual survive. We Malaysia so big, much bigger than Singapore, and we behave like all idiot. Proton is our start, and let it to be continued. Datsun, a japanese car manufacturer in early 80, where is it now? close door. Ford, hey you guys dont tell me you know nothing about it. Ford also close door for 3 times. Who support them? Government(US) give them whole logs of $ to survive. Ford use SOCH engine. never make it better. car QC is good(due to engineers), but management suck. car QC good in what? you know that? engine weak, performance is bad. what else? Now Ford design new engine, they are learning to use other technik. they bought over part of Proton(I heard that once, not sure is true or not), they bought over Mazda(this is true case), they plan to bought over Nissan. why cant those Mazda and Nissan continue business? ask yourself. they cant compete with company that support by government. and Japan dont make raw material themselves. and some of the car you bought is build by the rotten ship metal. those rosak ship, japan take it, disassembly it, make it metal again. you though all the metal are new from the mountain? Malaysia own production, car and steel from last year is just started. before that, all cant consider as self thing. We bought steel from Japan, engine from Japan, even good plastic from Japan. if proton use all those good quality material, the cost will be even higher than what you see now. this is the main reason Government put such a high tax on import cars. wake up, malaysia can boleh if you all work up with the country.
Well, I'm proud to be a Malaysian too. But nationalistic pride should not blind us to the obvious truth. Proton has definitely been mismanaged from the word Go! It was created by a government who were honestly just trying to find a way to create jobs. It didn't matter if the people were qualified or not. As long as Proton creates jobs, it will keep the people happy and the government in power. The people in charge of Proton are just interested in making a lot of money from a population that buys their cars because it was the nationalistic thing to do; and also because the government effectively put foreign cars out of reach, except for the rich. Now, Proton has grown since then. They even bought over Lotus. But that's not really an achievement since Lotus was a failed car company in the first place. And second, Proton was only able to survive so freaking long and buy Lotus because of unrelenting support from the government. Come on, how long are we supposed to bottle-feed Proton? It's not about Chinese working with Malays or Indians or etc. All of us, Malaysians - Malay, Chinese, Indians, etc, have spent way too much supporting Proton, a company that doesn't even believe in its own nationalistic roots. And off topic a bit. True, racism and other forms of bigotry exist worldwide. But that doesn't mean it doesn't exist here. To be honest, at least other countries officially believe in equal opportunities, as stated in their constitutions and laws. But read up on our own Constitution and laws. See if you can spot any sense of equality in there. Now, back to the topic, we should not be talking about racism, etc. I get a long fine with all races. Heck, it's about Proton and how they have been running it. Look at the new Gen 2. The "pride" of Proton. A car they claimed was developed completely in Malaysia, from the engine to the exhaust. But look at what it ended up as. A cheap copy of the Lotus Elise inside, after getting so much help from Lotus engineers. So, are our Malaysian engineers really using brain power this time? Or this just another lousy copy and paste job? I also want Malaysia to have a car company they can be proud of. But not by throwing money into it until someone gets it right. We must have a little more pride in what we do. We should believe in innovation, quality, etc. Not throwing money into glory projects like Proton. Honestly, Proton is a disgrace. BTW, my father works in a steel factory. Malaysia has always had a lot of steel production capacity. In fact, my father's steel factory has had to sell steel overseas due to insufficient demand in the country. If Proton is buying their steel from outside the country, I would be asking myself why. After all, it's a "NATIONAL" car project, right? It should be buying steel from local companies.
I'm really sorry, but from your posts, it really shows that you know nothing about cars. You got so many facts wrong! 1. Datsun = Nissan. They have decided to drop the Datsun name during the 80s. They didn't go bankrupt as you have said. Datsun 120Y, Nissan Sunny 130Y, sound familiar? 2. Fiat owns Ferrari since the late 60s. Ferrari don't make money from the cars? Do you know they are charging more than 600k pounds for their limited production car Ferrari Enzo? Ok, that is not their major source of income, because they have one of the biggest budgets in F1 thanks to sponsorship. And even Ferrari is helping Fiat to cover their lost... 3. Merc engine is hot? How can you say they are hot = bad? It's just like saying Prescott is a bad processor because it's hot! 4. Rocroy??? Did you mean Rolls Royce? 5. Honda may have good engines, but they were never famous for their reliability, I'm not sure if it has changed now. 6. Ford never use DOHC engines? (I hope your SOCH is a typo!) Do you still remember Ford TX3, that 80s car? It was one of the early budget road cars to use 1.8L DOHC, far ahead of most Japanese cars during that time. 7. What are you talking about??? Nissan is owned by Renault since the 90s. Ford owns Jaguar, Volvo, Land Rover, Aston Martin, Mazda. BMW owns Rolls Royce. Fiat owns Ferrari, Alfa Romeo, Lancia. So what's your point?
Wow! Shot on foot hehehe. A booze to our God Admin. I was just about to point out some of i myself hehehehe. I remember I was once like u, full of dreams...patriotic etc. After years in the real world, then u'll know wat i mean. I not saying dun dream, just that the world is ugly. How old is proton? Going 20 next year, can u imagine 20 year old still sucking milk from his mummy's t***? For years they're talking bout cutting cost, did u see a price drop in their car? WAJA is a disgrace, 15 years worth of experience and they came out with that!? There is nothing original bout the design, and yet it's ugly (boy it's ugly). I once own a Satria, believe I knwo their QC. I considered to be the lucky one, my car didn't give too much problem. Once I took my car for service and I had a chance to talk other Proton car owners, all the complaints they have. The first rule in business - Customer Satisfacttion, and they can even do that. Ok enuf BS... BTW just to add Nissan was on the brink of bankrupcy when Renault bought them over, now look at them. Selling quality cars, doing extremly good in the US market (UK as well - their X-Trail was voted best allrounder SUV in Fifth-gear, beating Rav4, CRV, Range Rover, and some Mitsubishi). Maybe we should sell Proton to Renault hahahaha.
Do you think Renault will want to buy Proton? Well, maybe if the price is LOW enough and they get to fire 80% of the people in there.
Proton not worth buying.. errr.. Chai .. honda not reliable ? .. why do you say so ? .. i thought they are damn freaking reliable ??? i have a 13years old accord .. i do encounter some problems.. any old stuffz sure will have prats which needed to be changed.. only problems encountered not long ago was radiotor leak ( yes.. it leak .. engine was boiling hot but but it still runs ) & clutch pump leak ..
ermm .. one more thing i wanna add.. merc engine hot ehhh ? everyengine is hot.. tell me one that is not hot ???? did you know most european cars have smaller radiotors.. that why they have to be "tropicalize" for our weather .. let say .. we use an Intel P4 ... so .. if your PC is in area with air temperature of 10c .. are you gonna use an extremely big heatsink ???? then .. if you PC is in a area with air temperature of 30c .. are you gonna use passive cooling with smaller heatsink ..
Compare among other Japanese cars, it's not as reliable. But I guess that isn't true now. (Not from your experience, mind you. ) Anyway, I just watched one of the Fifth Gear episode, X-Trail was voted by the journalist as the best small 4x4 under 20k pound, beating CRV, RAV4, Santa Fe, Jeep Cherokee, Kia Sorento, Land Rover Freelander, Mitsubishi Outlander, Subaru Forestor, Suzuki Grand Vitara. Yes, it's a huge roundup! Ok, now back to topic.
Heh.. One more thing about quality control in Malaysia. It's not a Malaysian problem. It's not that we are stupid or useless at making quality cars. It's whether we want to do it or not. Look at the locally assembled cars like the Honda, Kia, BMW, etc. If they can assemble them with a high level of quality, why can't Proton do the same? It's all about attitude and company culture. Proper business entities like Honda, Kia, BMW, etc concentrate on making the best cars they can because they know it will encourage people to buy from them in the future. A good word of mouth will also improve sales for them. But it's different at Proton. Their company culture is - "Why bother? They HAVE to buy from us. Worse comes to worse, the government will prop us up.". THAT is the problem with Proton. They have been sucking on the government's teats for over 20 years and they still don't want to wean.
u know since this few years plotong keep on making ah beng mobile?? 1. their bengswara and bengwira using the non-performance almost 20 years old mitsu engine??? using the almost 20years old chasssis(iswara)..just changed the bumper and it is consider a new car already!! is this the so called improvement?? 2. we seldom heard of aircond problem in the previous plotong rite?? it used to be freezing cold....but u know, in the latest batch (2003/2004) of wira, iswara, plotong used a cheaper and smaller Patco aircond compressor(to save cost and also to cheat all the malaysian) which is not cold!!! this is the improvement??? rubbish.... 3. many year 2000 onward wira 1.5 auto which used the Siemens ECU have engine stalling problem when braking at high speed in D mode..which the SC cant seem to fix it until today....the pervious carb and mitsu ECU-ed wira have no this kind of problem....so this is improvement?? 4. plotong discontinue the 4G92 powered wira 1.6 since 1998 if not mistaken...this wira is among the best/troule-free wira that ever made by them but they discontinued it! WTF?? instead, they continue producing the 4G15 powered 3 speed auto wira 1.5?? running backward? 5. all wira/iswara 1.3 and 1.5 is underpowered car....u can try floor the padel of the wira and see how fast it can run..at the same time..try it with some same class japanese car perodua is wayyyyy better than plotong, p2 have less QC problem and using a far more advance engine that plotong plotong is cheating all malaysian using their junk...somemore, it is way overpriced they dont improve over time and will never change their QC problem...instead, making it worse it is time to tell the mahaleel to F*CK OFF!!
